I think it’s a real struggle and the response that we are seeing right now is how countries are grappling with what they are going to do about the current order. Let me just underscore here that we are in transition time with the SDGs. As we have always said, it would take a couple of years to transition from the MDGs to the SDGs.

I think he’s given me fodder for my advocacy. Because when I go back into those sterile rooms, that somehow craft language that I don’t understand, and many people don’t understand, we can break it down. And this is where I think the partnership with the media is so important. This is a new partnership that we need to have.

The response to that is so complicated; it’s not a neat number, it’s not a neat set of targets. I think that, first, we should acknowledge that the Millennium Development Goals (MDGs) were a really good effort. It was the first time the world came together to set a number of integrated issues together. We might not have achieved all of them everywhere but we knew that it did work and therefore, what we did was take it a step further.

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I think we must stop stereotyping some of these issues. The truth of the matter is that there is an evolution of society. At one point, you have one breadwinner, at another point you have more than one breadwinner and a different kind of context and environment. How do we empower everyone to have a role and a place in the home, in the workplace and in society? I think if we do that, we will balance the decisions that we take and we will not be shut out of it.

I think there’s a disconnect between science, the 1.5 degrees and the reality on the ground. We need to link it, we need to say a third of Pakistan is underwater, because we’ve just had floods that are melting glaciers, and we can tie that to China, and it’s industrial pollution. We can do all this. So how do you tell the story?

First of all, I think Africa is trying to make those strides that are necessary to achieving SDG 5 (Gender Equality). But the approach to development in Africa has always been ad hoc, and I think we have been pitting some of our greatest challenges against each other in terms of making choices. For example, we will say, Well we have to make a choice between a woman and health. Or a woman and an education budget. And I think this is where we have got it wrong. The fact is that women are an integral part of any investment, be it in health, in education, in agriculture, etc. Africa needs to recognize that our human resources are the biggest asset base that we have, and to ignore investing in 50% of it, is just foolhardy and affects results, as well as the rights that women have in their lives.

I think men have to recognise that in every home, the woman has a right to participate in the economy and has the abilities to contribute to that. But that should not be done to the detriment of the home, and it should be a shared responsibility.

The diversity piece has lost its meaning, because we’ve sort of pigeonholed different parts of our society that are different, and will choose to live differently. And what we need to see is healthy respect, and that these are the threads of our human fabric.

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There are so many. Climate for me is the biggest challenge that we have, and opportunity. So when a farmer says to me that this is not about a flood, or temperatures, it’s about I wake up in the morning and my crop is gone because of a dust storm, and that dust storm has come because of drought, and my farm is gone, my livelihood is gone.